|   hydro vs. cable: which has better "metering" or "feel"? | Cassius
Jul 14, 2002 10:27 PM | | Thanx to everyone for the responses to my question about hydro pros & cons. Now I'm wondering this: Do cable-operated discs (or even rim brakes, for that matter) have better "feel", as in the rider being able to tell how to meter the brake lever in certain situations, as opposed to hydros, which don't actually have a solid connection to the rider's hand. Like I said, I'm mountain bike ignorant, but I'm really enjoying hearing the opinions you people have. I say that cables transfer more feel. |
| Hydros have better feel :-) | Mobster
Jul 14, 2002 11:23 PM | | I myself think that hydros have better feel. Why? Well...
Let's compare what do you actually feel when braking.
Cables:
-you can feel your cable stretching
-you can feel resistance from cables rubbing against cable housing
-there might even be minimal flex from the actual brake parts
-cables 'mute' the feeling wich you receive from brake pads rubbing against disc
Hydros:
-there is no resistance from the lines
-there is no fluid compression
-there are no flexing parts (like brake arm)
-since fluid is transmitting inputs you can feel everything that is happening between brake pad and disc in your brake lever |
| Avid mechs have better feel because... | shiggy©®
Jul 15, 2002 12:48 AM | | ...I can set them up to feel however I want them to. |
| Like asking which food tastes best | Spar¡cus
Jul 15, 2002 6:27 AM | | It's personal preference.
I've owned Hayes hydraulics and Avid mechanicals. The Hayes are good brakes, but comparing "feel" I always felt a degree removed from what was going on at the wheel with my hydraulics. The lever felt a tad sluggish compared to a cable. My lever pull is lighter with a cable as well.
With the cable brakes I can't feel any cable stretch, housing compression or friction as someone mentioned above. Perhaps if someone used inferior components &/or sloppy setup of their system these aspects would enter into the equation. I find my Avids slightly more powerful than my Hayes were. (I say "were" because after two years of use I traded my Hayes for a[nother] set of new Avid mechanicals.)
With the mechanicals, I also enjoy the ability to choose whichever lever feels best to my hands.
Use whichever one you like best. You'll be happy either way.
--Spary |
| Hey, | Tyler S.
Jul 15, 2002 7:52 AM | | how are you liking the new pads you're testing for Avid? They're sending me a set as well -- just wondering what you thought. |
| Hey, | Spar¡cus
Jul 15, 2002 3:06 PM | | Lonnie at Avid says they've got something like six different disc pad compounds being tested. I've been using the "A compound." From what I understand this one is a harder compound than the currently-on-the-market UPCs. The A's seem generally good but on ultraendurance rides (like 50+ miles with over 8,000' vertical change or so) the A pads seem to glaze easier than the UCPs. That's when they begin to squwak and fade a bit. This might not be such a bad deal for most riders most of the time. I say this because there are a lot of people who never do rides of such duration or elevation change, and for them the A's might hold up just fine.
The A pads work great in the wet and by virtue of their harder compound I would expect them to last longer than UPC's. I'm going to move them to my winter bike and do more testing in the fall/winter.
--Spary |
| Yeah, but hydros stay feelin good.... | firecrotch
Jul 15, 2002 8:49 AM | | You cable guys have to clean your cables periodically so that they run smoothly. Hydros feel good all the time cuz their sealed. JK, whatever floats your boat, but I prefer hydros, just my humble opinion. I like the tighter modulation (some call it the on/off feel) and the solid feel. I think I might give the avids a try, soon though. I might throw just a front on my older MTB.
-Ryan |
| ummmm.... NO | Nonny
Jul 15, 2002 7:27 PM | | ...in over a year of riding in all kinds of conditions i have yet to need to do any cable cleaning or other adjustments to my Avid discs (an occasional extra click of the pad adjusters to compensate for wear but that's it), whereas with the 3 Hope Mini's i've dealt with over the same time period I have honestly lost count of the number of times i've had to bleed and/or adjust the darn things, they are great when everything works right but in my experience the hydraulics definitely have needed alot more maintenance than the cable actuated Avids have.
(YMMV of course...)
Non. (NADS#089, MCM#089) |
| re: hydro vs. cable: which has better "metering" or "feel"? | Hammerheadbikes
Jul 15, 2002 3:21 PM | | get ready for a holy war of biblical proportions!
Charles |
| Only you can answer that | Pat T.®
Jul 15, 2002 4:00 PM | | It is so much personal preference, the Avids are at the top of the list for performance right up there with Magura Louise/Marta's, Hope Mini's, Formula B4's, ect. The best thing you can do is to try and ride as many bikes as you can and see which system feels right for you, it also depends what you plan to do. Now in my opinion the hydro's feel way better, I have never liked the "feel" of cable brakes. As far as transfering feel...hydro's win as long as the system is bled correctly.
Pat T.® MCM #69, MSPS #003 |
| your mileage DEFINITELY will vary | gonzostrike
Jul 16, 2002 7:25 AM | | my experience is the exact opposite of nonny's. my Avid Mechs caused endless problems compared to my Avid v-brakes. The pads wore VERY quickly and always needed adjustment. The cables worked horribly when routed normally, but improved when run with full housing. But the rear always felt squishier, probably from cable/housing friction.
The Hope Minis have felt perfect from Day One. The problems I've had with them have been mostly noise-related. The feel has been consistently buttery and reliable.
I think the Avids are so multi-adjustable to account for the distinct feel and action difference between cable and hydraulic. Avid has done an EXCELLENT job with the Mech Disc, no doubt about it. But I still got rid of my Avids after switching to Hope Minis, and I do not regret that move. I'll never use a cable disc brake again. Hope Minis are going on my next bike. |
| Definitely mechanical for me. | fonseca
Jul 16, 2002 7:05 PM | | I started off with magura louise, which cost me a small fortune (paid retail). I also tried a pair of Julies for a while. In fact I thumbed my nose to mechanicals back then...but after a few months of _nonstop_ problems, and countless hours of bleeding, adjustment, money spent checking my frame and fork's mounts for alignment, replacing lines, reading every FAQ and post on magura discs, etc, I gave avids a try based on the great reviews here. Super easy to set up, they bedded in fast, and I haven't had to make any adjustments to them at all, except to give the outer pad adjuster a click every once in a while.
I love being able to have the exact lever feel I want, and because I use high quality housing and cables, I have never experienced any mushiness or cable stretch. The rear brake feels just as frictionless as the front.
I'm not against hydraulics, and my one complaint with mechanicals is their weight, but I think they are just as powerful as the best hydraulics out there, and much easier to set up and maintain, and offer far more adjustment. I still plan to try another set of lightweight hydraulics in the next year, but as far as I'm concerned mechs have a far better feel; you can set them to feel however you want, from soft and squishy to on/off and everything inbetween.
Fonseca NADS 898 |
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