|   Hayes Mech or Avid Mech? HELP! | KamikazeRider
Jan 4, 2004 6:07 PM | | Im looking for to add disc brakes to my bike.
What are the pro and cons of AVID over HAYES mechanicals?
Hayes are way cheaper but the reviews on the AVID seem much better?
Is it worth it?
On EBAY I saw new avid mechanicals for $100, is that good?
At SUPERGO they are $180? $90 for f and r?
OR should I skip the mech and go straight to hrydo's?
I am an agressive XC rider/ trailrider. No long hard descent...roller coaster type riding.
Thanks boyz! |
| re: Hayes Mech or Avid Mech? HELP! | uber-stupid
Jan 4, 2004 7:05 PM | | Hayes brakes suck. They lack power, and the last set I installed broke when I clamped the cable on. They're just crappy brakes, and not worth your time.
Avids are good... keep looking around ebay and try to figure out what the average price is, for what size model. I think the difference you're seeing in price is between mechanical and hydraulic, or between one brake, vs a full set. |
| re: Hayes Mech or Avid Mech? HELP! | KamikazeRider
Jan 4, 2004 9:01 PM | | Do you mean All HAYES brakes suck or just the mechanical. Cuz the Hayes Hydro are like #1 disc brake.
And no...the Avid mech are expenive than the Hayes mech. I was confused about the the full set or just f or r. But if you add the the r and f to the hayes there more expenisive according to SUPERGO.com
Check it out.
So stay away from HAYES?
STAY away from mechanicals too?
What about the new SHIMAN XT hyrdos?
Thanks BOYZ! |
| Hayes appear to be Avid copies minus the Avid system... | Danny
Jan 4, 2004 9:30 PM | | of adjustment washers...right down to the twist adjustment wheel on the opposite side. Potentially, they could be harder to get setup but if your bosses are square they should work well. They use the same pads as the hydraulic. I just installed a set on an Avalanche and they worked great straight off.
The trick to any disc system is proper setup. You need to get the caliper setup square to the rotor if you want good performance.
Hydraulics will set you back considerably more...but are worth it if weight is an issue. They have their own pile of hassles...bleeding and leaks being two that mechanicals will never suffer from.
So, bottom line, don't be afraid of the Hayes...they are a screaming good deal. A set of Avids off Ebay could also be a great deal...just check out the seller's rating. However, if racing is in your future...weight will be too. In that case you should consider a lighter set of hydraulics. But then...that is a whole expensive path to go down...what with titanium railed seats and carbon handlebars. |
| Seems like people who have actually ridden both really prefer | Tscheezy
Jan 5, 2004 12:25 AM | | the Avid mechs. Look at all the $3-5k bikes posted over on What Bike To Buy sporting Avid mechs when the owners could afford any make of brake they wanted. They are just great brakes. You NEVER see a decent bike with the Hayes mechs. Their reputation precedes them.
tscheezy |
| If I had infinite money I'd have bought Avids... | Danny
Jan 5, 2004 3:34 AM | | like on my other two bikes and if the Hayes mechanicals had sucked I would have kicked myself for being so cheap. But, I got lucky, I guess, and the Hayes have been perfect. They worked from the getgo...feel exactly like my Avids do...good modulation...good power...no squeal. I did a double take when the Hayes arrived. They look almost exactly like Avids...appears like Hayes just copied the Avid design...minus the adjustable, cupped washers.
By the way, I threw out a pair of Formula mechanicals a few years ago. Got 'em with an inexpensive wheelset..totally flimsy things...you could see how they would twist with use. Supposedly, the new Formula mechancals are greatly improved. |
| Avid... | Schtoo
Jan 5, 2004 6:49 AM | | There, a simple answer. Just get the Avids and be done with it.
The Hayes are probably HMX-1/2 at that price and they just plain suck. I know, I own a set. Worst money I ever spent on my bike.
I also own a Deore 515LA and an Avid 185.
The Deore caliper is beyond compare for feel and modulation. Unfortunately the pads suck and it's a brick.
The Avid caliper is lighter, easier to adjust and easier to set up. Also has plenty of feel and is just plain nice. Not comparing the rotor, it's a 185mm and it's not fair to compare the whole brake system when the 185 has a big mechanical advantage over a 160.
The Hayes caliper is ultra light. That's what happens when something lacks material where it needs it. The caliper just plain sucks. The pads are good and the rotor is great.
The new Suntour mech discs are interesting if you could find them. Not to heavy, good modulation and have a 180f/140r with a nice rigid caliper. Also dirt cheap.
Formula mechs suck. Don't bother.
Shimano 475 mechs are not bad, but they weight about 10,000 lbs.
Just get the Avids and avoid having regrets about buying something else and not having bought the Avids when you had the chance, OK?
Best brake? Avid caliper, Hayes/Avid pads, Hayes rotor. :) |
| Always a risk of what level part you get when buying closeouts | Danny
Jan 5, 2004 7:56 AM | | I can only assume the Hayes I got from Supergo for $110 were the better ones because they have been problem free and were good right from the getgo. |
| No, you got the same ones... | Schtoo
Jan 7, 2004 5:42 AM | | It's just that some people don't mind the Hayes mechanicals.
Me, I don't like having something large and unweildy forced up my back passage.
Some people don't mind it.
P.S. I draw no similarity between HMX-1 afficiondos and "not that there's anything wrong with that..." kinda folks. Everyone makes their own choice, like I have made mine.
P.P.S. Danny, have you actually tried another disc brake that was properly set up other than your Hayes? It's hard to appreciate anything without a proper comparison, you know? |
| Yes, I've got Avid Mechanicals on my other two bikes. | Danny
Jan 7, 2004 7:32 AM | | Work great...fantastic modulation, but to be honest, so far I can't see any performance difference between my Avids and the Hayes HMX1's. The Hayes, just like the Avids, took next to zero burn-in time. They just worked perfectly from the getgo. The modulation is perfect and they don't drag or squeel. The setup looks to be an exact copy of Avids, right down to the little twist wheel on the wheel side. As with all disc brakes proper, square setup of the rotor is essential to good performance and I could see where this could be a problem with the Hayes if your bosses aren't square because Hayes doesn't have the adjustability of the Avids.
The only thing I can't comment on is long term durability seeing as I've only got a dozen miles on them. However, seeing as they are the same pads and rotors as on Hayes hydraulics, and durability doesn't seem to be an issue with them, I expect no problems. |
| Remember me in 3 months... ;) ntxt | Schtoo
Jan 8, 2004 7:35 AM | | |
| I've used both.... | Ryan C.
Jan 6, 2004 3:39 PM | | and as you probably would've guessed, I liked the Avids a lot better. The Tri-align adjustment made a world of difference in my case (the disc tabs on my Psylo had a generous amound of paint on them, making the alignment off with the Hayes). Power, from what I could tell, was about equal using SD-7 levers on both. One problem I discovered after extensive use is that the Hayes caliper actually runs out of adjustment for the pads. When my pads went under about 50% material, the torque arm on the caliper actually bottomed out (fixed pad was also dialed all the way out). I discovered this when riding down an extended downhill. The lever feel went from a little mushy (like most levers feel) to dead-solid firm. At that point the brakes started to feel weak. I played with the caliper adjustment to no avail. Had to replace the pads even though the old ones were still perfectly good. This problem is largely due to the fact that there is no independent pad adjustment for the moving pads, you're simply supposed to use the barrel adjuster at the caliper or lever to adjust for pad wear, which moves the torque arm (which also preloads it and effectively increases the amount of hand force necessary to actuate the brakes). Because of this problem alone, I don't recommend these brakes. The alignment can be fixed with a Gnannomat, Spot tool or careful filing (which is what I did), but the pad adjustment will always be inferior. In conclusion, just buy the F#$king Avids!
-Ryan |
| I have to second the Avids | pimpbot
Jan 12, 2004 11:20 PM | | The Hayes are decent, but slightly cheezy. I had to take a file to a bud's Hayes HMX1.1's when the rotor would not quite clear the caliper body, no matter how I adjusted it. I hated to do it, but that was the only fix.
Never an issue with my Avids. I bolt them on, do a bit of tweaking, and if they need more tweaking, it's easy to do.
Some shops sell them for $69 a set, like Jensonusa.com. That is not a lot more than the Hayes, maybe $20 an end. For that much dough, just get the real deal, and don't mess with the others.
I've even seen deals for like $180 with SD7 levers. |
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