|   hey racers: speaking of tubeless.... | Gary
Feb 20, 2002 7:18 AM | | How many of you are racing on UST wheels? What do you think - great, good, OK, sucks, etc. They seem to be heavier than the comparable non UST wheels - isn't rotating weight, especially tire/tube the most important??? |
| re: hey racers: speaking of tubeless.... | WarrGuru
Feb 20, 2002 11:15 AM | | Rolling weight is important, but so is rolling resistance. I prefer to race on a fast rolling tire even if it weighs about the same as my knobbies. Most tires that are ultra light puncture / wear out too quickly.
Just my 2 cents. |
| I am... | GP
Feb 20, 2002 1:14 PM | | I've been racing CrossMax USTs with Michelin Comp S Tubeless since the middle of last season, about 8 months, with no raceday problems at all. I weigh about 185-190 lbs in racing form.
I've had a couple punctures with the Michelins out on the trail (a nail once, some other sharp objects, but thorns seem to be too small to hurt them); they're easy to fix with a standard patch kit and CO2 inflater (you patch the same way you would a tube, just on the inside wall of the tire). The Michelins wear pretty fast - no surprise for a soft compund race tire. Very grippy in most situations. The Michelins are decently light, too - mine weighed about 640 each, not much more than a normal tire and a tube (plus, I always used to run tire liners, that's 200gms I don't need anymore).
The big drawback to the Michelins is rolling resistance. They roll like a full knobby; they sound like truck tires on the freeway. I could REALLY feel it during my last race.
So, I'm switching to Pythons - I'll trade 100 grams for a faster rolling tire. I know all about the empirical studies about rotating weight and all, but the truth is, I can't really notice any weight difference - even while climbing. I CAN tell the difference in rolling resistance, though. Another advantage the Pythons have is better traction on really steep, out-of-the-saddle climbs. You have to be real careful with the Michies, they like to slip if your weight balance is just the slightest bit off. I've also never had a flat with Pythons, their rubber seems to be a little tougher.
As far as the wheels go, I've never had a better set of wheels than the CrossMax UST. 1620 grams is a competitively light weight IMO, and they're tough enough. They went just slightly out of true after my first few weeks on them. Once they were re-trued, they've been rock-solid. I've got a few rock dings in the ceramic, but it still holds up well, the ceramic's not flaking off around the chipped area. Haven't yet broken a single spoke - and I was breaking the DT stainless spokes on my Sun-Ringle RPM Lites on a weekly basis (now THERE'S a wheelset to stay away from!)
Overall, a totally positive experience. |
| I do too... | greg
Feb 21, 2002 9:29 AM | | I've been on Mavic CrosMax UST w/ Pythons since 12/00. Raced an entire season on them in AZ and did not have even one problem. I have found (MUCH to my surprise) that the UST Python hooks up on every surface I ride-- wet, loose, hardpack, etc... I love these tires. I tried Schwable Fast Fred UST's and Specialized Rockster S-works UST. Both tires are lighter than the Pythons by about 100g but neither hooked up like the Pythons. I did one race w/ the Fast Fred with no problems but it is a semi-slick so I had to change it for the next race. My rear rim needed truing once. In my opinion, these things are the best innovation for a racer since a front shock. I love not having to worry about flatting during a race. I flatted the rear one time while training but this nail would have flatted any tire. I love these wheels. I don't notice the weight either. I'll ramble a little more-- I think the weight difference from standard spoked wheels is not noticible because the CrossMaxes as so stiff. You get instant power to the wheel as soon as you crank-- no noticible spoke flex under power or wheel flex in hard cornering. Awesome invention! just my $ .83 |
| the math is actually easy... | mtbmon
Feb 21, 2002 10:34 AM | | i don't know what class you run but in expert class its as simple as this, you flat, you lose. Im kind of a weight weenie but I too gave into the UST thing. In the event of flat on the UST's (which still can happen) I carry a CO2 and a tube (yes they can be used in a UST setup). I really think that the reduced likelihood of flats more than makes up for the weight. The Pythons are far and away the best all around tire Ive used (except heavy mud). The hook like a knobby and roll like a slick. Ive heard rumor of a 400g UST tire coming out but haven't seen one yet. A breakthough like that would seal the decision. I strongly recommend UST. In addition to the flat issue, I think they brake and corner better due to the slightly lower air pressure (I still run mine at 44 psi for races). |
| Thanks all (more) | triPete
Feb 22, 2002 7:00 AM | | One more ?: How much pressure do you use? And for Greg - what did you think of the Rocksters (they came on my SWorks)? Thanks again. |
| Thanks all (more) | scottssss
Feb 22, 2002 2:55 PM | | Just to add in my two cents: I love my ust system, couldn't afford crossmax, so I went with crossrocs. biggest penalty is the weight and a much flexier wheel. that said, I am way faster with the ust wheelset than my mavic/xt set up. I am 190, and I race with 39 lbs in the back and 36 up front. I've experimented a bunch and this seems to give me the best combination of control in corners (where you can really tell the difference with a ust tire) and not too bad rolling resistance. I race in arizona like the poster above, and I have only used the pythons...no problems at all...they roll so fast and grip like a full knobby in my opinion. I picked up a full mile per hour over my old mythos front back combo (that I would run at 44 lbs) even running my python at 39/36. good luck. |
| Rocksters... | greg
Mar 1, 2002 11:14 AM | | I did not like the rockster in the rear but it was fine up front. I changed it though because I tend to lean on my front end during tight cornering and the rockster washed out more than the Python. If your cornering style is more conventional than mine then the rockster could be good. I love the weight but they just don't hook up as nicely as the pythons. G |
| re: hey racers: speaking of tubeless.... | Walt
Mar 3, 2002 9:58 AM | | Try the Stan's tubeless system, if you like to tinker and want a nice tubeless system that's a bit lighter than UST. www.notubes.com. I've run them for quite a while with no problems. Downside is that you've got to do a bit more maintenance.
-Walt |
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